SECRET EMPIRE to WAR of the REALMS

[michel]

I've already implemented this period, you will see the changes I've made at the next update, it will be easier to discuss them then.

[michel]

DOMINO:HS 1-5
UX5 19 (3 - 8)-FB, UX5 1-9, UX@5 1, UX5 10 (1 - 27), UX5 19 (9 - 10)-FB (X-Men "die") (Captain Marvel appears by herself in space)
AOXM:O 1-FB
XFOR5 1-6 (after UX@5 1, UX5 10)
W:IW 1-5 (shortly after X-Men die, after FF5 4, IWARS ∞)
UX5 19 (11 - 13)-FB, 11-FB
CHMPS2 22-23, 26-FB (Vision repaired) (Miles recovering) (Sam no longer Nova)
CHMPS2 24 [early-to-mid January]
CHMPS2 25-27 (after ANT&WASP2 1-5, DP7 4)
CHMPS@ 1
MIMOSM 1 (2-4)-FB (new school semester)
RUN5 20-27, 28 (1-5) (new school semester)
P12 6 (xxx-20), 7-12 (at least 3 months since P12 1-6)

In RUN5 23, Nico receives a text from Dazzler. But Dazzler is stuck in the Age of X-Man-Verse at this time, so RUN5 20-28 should be placed before UX5 10.

[Col_Fury]

Good catch! Right before UX5 1-10 works.

[michel]

In the listing, there's a big gap between WH 3-7 and WH 8-12, but WH 8 continues directly from WH 7 and I don't see much place for a gap.
WH 8-12 has the Black Widow, so it's probably after IWARS, Titania has the Absorbing Man on the phone in WH 8 and an editor note points to IMMH 9, and Dario Agger is defeated in WH 12, so a little bit before his arrest in T5 9, so I would move WH 3-7 just before WH 8-12.

There's also a problem with Morgan le Fay from Earth-15238. WH 10-FB shows how she's enslaved by Dario Agger and Roxxon, and in WH 1/2, we see the portal from Roxxon to Weirworld, so Morgan should be unavailable between WH 1 and WH 9-12. Unfortunately, she appears free in DP7 4. That would require to put DP7 1-4, and maybe DP:ASSN 1-6, before WH 1. What do you think?

[StrayLamb]

In the listing, there's a big gap between WH 3-7 and WH 8-12, but WH 8 continues directly from WH 7 and I don't see much place for a gap.
WH 8-12 has the Black Widow, so it's probably after IWARS, Titania has the Absorbing Man on the phone in WH 8 and an editor note points to IMMH 9, and Dario Agger is defeated in WH 12, so a little bit before his arrest in T5 9, so I would move WH 3-7 just before WH 8-12.

Just to throw some thoughts out there, there's a potential gap between pages 18 & 19 of WH 7, before Clay signs up. WH 8 (1 - 4:2) should be a flashback, occuring prior to WH 7 (19 - 20), as it shows what Korg was doing 3 days prior to Clay arriving in Weirdworld. Titania is on the phone to Absorbing Man at least a month before the main action of IMMH 8, according to the chronology presented in that issue, which shows Creel has been held for a month at this point. Agger has been under house arrest for two weeks in T5 9. Also, Dario Agger believes Thor to be dead in WH 7, which was published the same month as T5 5, IMMH 6, and A7 8. That could be shrugged off, but Agger keeps his eye on the news, and should be aware that Thor's back and has been running around with the Avengers at this point, otherwise that potentially places this much closer to where we have WH 1-2, and before T5 1.

[michel]

WH 7 (19) is a FB, following from WH 7 (5)-FB. Page 20 is "ten minutes later" after page 18.

[michel]

CA8 6* (Ross dies)
N:BD 1 (1 - 8)* [Namor heads to Vodan]
SS:BD 1 (1 - 27)* [Surfer investigates the Cosmic Train and rescues Goldie]
N:BD 1 (9 - 28)* [Namor on Vodan - a week after he left Atlantis]
SS:BD 1 (28 - 30)* [Surfer’s board leaves him]
N:BD 1 (29 - 30)* [Surfer’s board rescues Namor]
IMMH 3 [McGee investigates Hulk in SD - contacted by Langkowski]
IMMH 4 [McGee meets Walter at SD airport & they follow Hulk to Minnesota. “Oh Yah, You Betcha!”]
IMMH 5 [Hulk vs Sasquatch]
IMMH 6 [Two days later - Hulk challenged by Avengers]
IMMH 7 [Hulk vs Avengers - Thor injured - Iron Man in Hulkbuster with Motherboard AI (** see below)]
IMMH 8 (1 - 8) [Hulk at Shadow Base - Gamma Flight formed]
DS:BD 1 [Alternate Strange crashes to Earth just before sunset]
IMMH:BD 1-FB [Old man finds Eye of Agamotto after sunset]
IMMH 8 (9 - 20) [Colonel Danvers gave a press conference yesterday evening, announcing the formation of Gamma Flight - Hulk escapes Shadow Base at dawn]
IMMH:BD 1 [Banner enters Happy Trails just past noon]
DEF:BD 1 [Conclusion]
IMMH 9-13 (Ross’ spirit recently in hell)
WOTR:WS 2/3-FB ["a few weeks" before WOTR]
IHRT 1
CA8 7 (1-16) (less than a week after CA8 6, Cap learns Ross is dead)

General Ross dies in CA8 6. But in IMMH 6, Captain Marvel says she has phoned Ross to confirm that General Fortean was in charge of US Hulk Operations. Ross also gives Hulk's body to Fortean in IMMH 7, then denies he knows where Hulk's body has been sent in IMMH 8, so CA8 6 should be after IMMH 8 (1 - 8).

[Col_Fury]

Yeah, CA8 is a mess. The placement of the series just gets more confusing after this and at some point we're going to have to rethink and replace most of the volume.

Until that happens, though, I would say ignore trying to place CA8 6 - the end of the volume.

[StrayLamb]

Col. Fury's latest update already has CA8 6 after IMMH 3-8..

an update!

SECEMP
---
IMMH 3-8 (after WH 12)
CA8 6 (Ross dies)
SS:BD 1, N:BD 1, DS:BD 1, IMMH:BD 1, DEF:BD 1
IMMH 9-13 (Ross’ spirit recently in hell)
WOTR:WS 2/3-FB ["a few weeks" before WOTR]
IHRT 1
CA8 7 (1-16) (less than a week after CA8 6, Cap learns Ross is dead)
---

I had previously proposed this sequence..

---
A7 12, T5 9, T5 13-FB [T5 9 (2:2-4), T5 9 (10-11), T5 9 (5-9), T5 9 (12-17), A7 12 (6-20), T5 13 (9-10), T5 9 (1-2:1), T5 9 (18-20), T5 13 (1) ~ T5 13 (15:2), T5 13 (15:3-18) (Cul reports to Odin from Svartalfheim)
IMMH 9 (5)-FB (Two weeks before IMMH 9) (Late May)
A7 14-17, A7 20-FB (Capt Marvel returned to duty with Avengers)
IMMH 9 (7, 9)-FB (Eleven, Ten days before IMMH 9) (Late May)
N:BD 1 (1 - 8) [Namor heads to Vodan]
SS:BD 1 (1 - 3) [Galactus encounters the Cosmic Train]
SS:BD 1-FB [Surfer is sent to investigate the worlds of the Cosmic Train]
IMMH 9 (11)-FB (Five days before IMMH 9) (Late May)
SS:BD 1 (4 - 27) [Surfer investigates the Cosmic Train and rescues Goldie]
N:BD 1 (9 - 28) [Namor on Vodan - a week after he left Atlantis]
SS:BD 1 (28 - 30) [Surfer’s board leaves him]
N:BD 1 (29 - 30) [Surfer’s board rescues Namor]
IMMH 3 [McGee investigates Hulk in SD - contacted by Langkowski]
IMMH 4 [McGee meets Walter at SD airport & they follow Hulk to Minnesota. “Oh Yah, You Betcha!”]
IMMH 5 [Hulk vs Sasquatch]
IMMH 6 [Two days later - Hulk challenged by Avengers]
IMMH 7 [Hulk vs Avengers - Thor injured - Iron Man in Hulkbuster with Motherboard AI)
IMMH 8 (1 - 8) [Hulk at Shadow Base - Gamma Flight formed]
DS:BD 1 [Alternate Strange crashes to Earth just before sunset]
IMMH:BD 1-FB [Old man finds Eye of Agamotto after sunset]
CA8 6 (Ross murdered)
IMMH 8 (9 - 20) [Colonel Danvers gave a press conference yesterday evening, announcing the formation of Gamma Flight - Hulk escapes Shadow Base at dawn]
IMMH:BD 1 [Banner enters Happy Trails just past noon]
DEF:BD 1 [Conclusion]
IMMH 9-13 (Day after Hulk escaped Shadow Base, Ross’ spirit recently in hell)
---

[michel]

Also, ASM5 16 is pretty clear that Kraven hasn’t appeared since ASM 637. Instead, he sent 87 clones of himself (made by the High Evolutionary) into the world to prove themselves worthy. Meanwhile, Kraven focused on re-establishing his fortune and kingdom.

So yeah, that was a Kraven clone who befriended Squirrel Girl. And he’s (most likely) dead now. Rats.

OK, let's look at his listing:

KRAVEN/SERGEI KRAVINOFF
...
ASM 637
BCAT2 4
BP:MWF 518
BP:MWF 519 (17)-FB
BP:MWF 519
BP:MWF 520
SG2 4
V2 2
IH4 10
IH4 11
SCRS2 6
SCRS2 16
SCRS2 20-BTS
SCRS2 21
SCRS2 22
SCRS2 23
[USQG 1]
[USQG 6-BTS]
HTD5 6-FB
USQG2 6
HTD5 6
CASW 8
ASOFF:APHO
USQGBUM/U
RR3 2
RR3 3
RR3 4
RR3 5
CASR 13-FB
CASR 13
SECEMP:BNW 3
USQG2 22/2
USQG2 23/2
USQG2 24/2
USQG2 25 (1 - 17)
USQG2 32-FB
V 155
V 156
V 157
V 158
CA 696
OML2 41-FB
USQG2 32
USQG2 33
USQG2 34
USQG2 35
ASM5 2-FB
ASM5 3-FB
ASM5 4-FB
ASM5 5-FB
ASM5 5-BTS
JJ 15
OML2 41
OML2 42

ASM5 16 says Kraven has been slaughtering Ani-Men for months, before he reveals himself to the High Evolutionary and has him make clones.
It also says Ana Kravinoff left him when she learned about the clones, and she appears with him in BCAT2 4, SG2 4, SCRS2 6, 16 and 22-23.
So the clone sequence should happen after SCRS2 23.
After that, we can have a KRAVEN CLONE II listing for the appearances in USQG, USQG2, HTD5, USQGBUM/U, but what about the other Kraven appearances? Do we presume they're all clones's appearances and remove them from his listing?

[Spurs91]

Been reading the post-Secret Empire era. You have GENX2 8-9 & GENX 85-87 significantly later than the Mighty Thor 'Asgard/Shi'ar war' but in Generation X 86 Quentin Quire confirms that his involvement in that Thor story was "in the last 4 days".

Edit: Looking back through threads, I'd forgotten that those MT2 issues are even before Secret Empire. And Googling tells me the Gen X issue in question came out 9 months after Quire appeared in Thor.

[Leoparis]

DS 390 (Strange shaves beard, no longer a vet) [“less than 2 weeks” after DS:DAMN]
JJ 12 (9-20), 13-17 (Purple Man dies)
Marvel 5 2nd story Avengers beardless Dr Strange
DEF5 10 (no beard Strange, blue cloak)

[robfj]

The just-out Thunderbolts v4 #5 has Nightmare saying he's been feeding off Hawkeye's insecurity and despair for a long time, and specifically that Avengers: No Road Home happened before West Coast Avengers v3. Which if true messes this thread up a bit.

[StrayLamb]

The following updates need to go in here..

---
WH 8-12 (after IWARS, before T5 9)
IMMH 9 (1,3)-FB [Mid-May]
POX 4 (7-14)-FB
INFERNO2 3 (4-5)-FB [(1-3)-FB is the same as POX 4 (7-14)-FB, and (4-5) follows on immediatley after. Mid-May]
DS5 10/2, 10-FB, 9-11
---
TSIM 6-11 (after IMMH 8) ["two weeks" before TSIM 14]
A7 18 (11,13,15)-FB
WOTR:JIM 1 (3)-FB ["4 weeks" before WOTR]
INFERNO2 3 (6)-FB [A month later. Mid-June]
FF5 5 (1 - 42), FFWED2, FF5 5 (43 - 60), 6-9 ["9 days" before WOTR]
---